Golf Sim Clubhouse Forum

Who do you think is the best designer in the game?

I`m thinking this is a loaded question lol. But I`ll give you my 3 favorites. There are a ton of great designers but my favorites are Terry Grayson, Robert Wagers and Robert@. Hope I didn`t pizz anyone off, That`s just my opinion.

ADC wrote:Who do you think is the best designer in the game?

Oh man ADC, that is like asking which of your kids is better...

I won't answer that one, but I can offer you this.... a list of all designers who produced the "A-List" courses along with their total number of courses and how many of those showed up on the A-List. This can give you some idea of what designers have turned out consistent quality over the years. The list is sequenced by number of courses.

So for example, if you download one Roberts 60 courses, you can be pretty sure you will get a good one. Not so much true with hover.

Designer ----- courses ----- A_List ----- %A
1 Robert@ ----- 60 ----- 47 ----- 78%
2 Hover ----- 43 ----- 2 ----- 5%
3 Smak2000 ----- 40 ----- 7 ----- 18%
4 Somerfelt ----- 36 ----- 28 ----- 78%
5 Jimi ----- 31 ----- 6 ----- 19%
6 Turner ----- 29 ----- 12 ----- 41%
7 Gabagoo ----- 23 ----- 17 ----- 74%
8 Dammpa ----- 20 ----- 5 ----- 25%
9 Mr Whiffle ----- 18 ----- 9 ----- 50%
10 Glacken ----- 17 ----- 7 ----- 41%
11 Brandt ----- 16 ----- 13 ----- 81%
12 Grayson ----- 16 ----- 11 ----- 69%
13 Ibjoey ----- 16 ----- 3 ----- 19%
14 TooTall ----- 16 ----- 1 ----- 6%
15 Polslad ----- 15 ----- 7 ----- 47%
16 Jones, Bobby ----- 14 ----- 13 ----- 93%
17 Gunsaullus ----- 14 ----- 8 ----- 57%
18 Crank ----- 14 ----- 4 ----- 29%
19 Hojgaard ----- 13 ----- 8 ----- 62%
20 Ogilvy2 ----- 13 ----- 8 ----- 62%
21 Horn ----- 13 ----- 4 ----- 31%
22 Opfer ----- 13 ----- 4 ----- 31%
23 Gary$1n2 ----- 12 ----- 4 ----- 33%
24 Paul, Art ----- 12 ----- 4 ----- 33%
25 Lawinski ----- 11 ----- 8 ----- 73%
26 DanO ----- 11 ----- 6 ----- 55%
27 Phillips ----- 11 ----- 3 ----- 27%
28 McHale ----- 11 ----- 2 ----- 18%
29 TCA2000 ----- 11 ----- 2 ----- 18%
30 Wagers ----- 10 ----- 10 ----- 100%
31 Indy Anna Jones ----- 10 ----- 7 ----- 70%
32 Swatmizer ----- 10 ----- 4 ----- 40%
33 Lothian ----- 10 ----- 2 ----- 20%
34 Shortees ----- 10 ----- 1 ----- 10%
35 Day ----- 9 ----- 7 ----- 78%
36 Johnson, Craig ----- 9 ----- 6 ----- 67%
37 Labranche ----- 9 ----- 6 ----- 67%
38 Rattlesnake ----- 9 ----- 3 ----- 33%
39 Pablo ----- 8 ----- 6 ----- 75%
40 Bryce ----- 8 ----- 4 ----- 50%
41 Zager ----- 8 ----- 2 ----- 25%
42 Divotmaker1 ----- 8 ----- 1 ----- 13%
43 Sandy_Lie ----- 8 ----- 1 ----- 13%
44 KSBC6499 ----- 7 ----- 6 ----- 86%
45 Trives ----- 7 ----- 4 ----- 57%
46 Anderson ----- 7 ----- 2 ----- 29%
47 Ferrin, Scott ----- 7 ----- 1 ----- 14%
48 Mattler ----- 7 ----- 1 ----- 14%
49 Steenstrup ----- 7 ----- 1 ----- 14%
50 PingKing ----- 6 ----- 5 ----- 83%
51 Dickson ----- 6 ----- 3 ----- 50%
52 Nehilla ----- 6 ----- 2 ----- 33%
53 Allen ----- 6 ----- 1 ----- 17%
54 Barker ----- 6 ----- 1 ----- 17%
55 BKFIN ----- 6 ----- 1 ----- 17%
56 Flippo ----- 6 ----- 1 ----- 17%
57 Bunch ----- 5 ----- 3 ----- 60%
58 OSUDavid ----- 5 ----- 3 ----- 60%
59 Good-O-Boy ----- 5 ----- 1 ----- 20%
60 Mabie ----- 5 ----- 1 ----- 20%
61 Ezmny2001 ----- 4 ----- 4 ----- 100%
62 IndyGoBlue ----- 4 ----- 4 ----- 100%
63 Graphite ----- 4 ----- 2 ----- 50%
64 Baker ----- 4 ----- 1 ----- 25%
65 Carroll ----- 4 ----- 1 ----- 25%
66 Dave506 ----- 4 ----- 1 ----- 25%
67 Hines ----- 4 ----- 1 ----- 25%
68 Caygle ----- 3 ----- 2 ----- 67%
69 Pyecraft ----- 3 ----- 2 ----- 67%
70 Carp53 ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
71 Helton ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
72 Hufnagle ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
73 Huxford ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
74 Irontross ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
75 Silvernail ----- 3 ----- 1 ----- 33%
76 Castle ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
77 Ekroth-DanO-Trives ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
78 JJ ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
79 Mikehandicap9 ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
80 Mygolfer Design ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
81 Somerfelt/Salter ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
82 Stone ----- 2 ----- 2 ----- 100%
83 Applecrumble ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
84 Brogdon ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
85 fireman215 ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
86 Gage ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
87 Manno152 ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
88 McMonagle ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
89 MonteChristo ----- 2 ----- 1 ----- 50%
90 A TCD Design ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
91 Antes ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
92 Carrol/Dano ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
93 Cavity Jack ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
94 CC © Designers Club  ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
95 DanO-Trives ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
96 Gabagoo/Crabster ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
97 Hillbilly Designs ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
98 Hojgaard,SoRep ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
99 Indy&Jimi ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
100 Marshall ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
101 Mr Whiffle, Too Tall ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
102 Pobs_UK ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
103 Robert@-OSUDavid ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
104 Robert@-Plugger ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
105 Strober ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
106 Strober/Anderson/McHale ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
107 Swatmizer-Seppie ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
108 Taylor ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
109 The Designers Club ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
110 Trip-Trey Prodn ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
111 Two Texans ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
112 Wagers-Grayson ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%
113 White ----- 1 ----- 1 ----- 100%

Thanks for the info. I think the % data for the "low submitters" is irrelevant. Somewhere, somehow, sometime, I got a Diploma in Statistical Analysis (Babbi, Walsh, the Null Hypothesis), but never had the opportunity to use it. However, you hit the nail on the head with your basic premise.
Great stuff, Dave

DAR! You are a fountain of info.

I think it would be very interesting for each designer active today to nominate a single course (1 only) of THEIR design for consideration to be added to Dar's "A" list or maybe a separate list entitled The Designers List. It dose'nt matter if it is already on the A list. This would be in the opinion of the designer only of what they consider to be THEIR very best work. Spencer.

With over 1600 courses - no one is going to agree. But personally, I like the A-list and rarely disagree with it. Designing has improved greatly in the last few years it seems - no disrespect to designers that are inactive today but the courses that have come out in the last 3 years are all way further along - better libraries, better textures, better techniques - more time to learn from the guys who were pioneers. I would guess that 85% of new courses coming out are going to make it into the A-list and none are probably going to be worse than a B-list course. The designers active right now are that good!

I personally rate by era - 1998 - 2002; 2003 - 2007; 2008 - present. I don't think you can compare a course that was produced in the early days with one now - we all learn from each other but somebody had to get the ball rolling. I still think that McHale's Augusta and Anderson's TPC at Sawgrass hold up today.

All that being said - Robert Wagers is a genius with the architect. The right amount of realism, playabillity and originality for my tastes. The man does his homework in preparing for a design. I think that is one reason why he only has 10 courses for download - that kind of attention to detail is draining. My opinions - your mileage will vary

Well for me it would be easy to list what I think is our (Greg and my) best course: Arcadia Bluffs (by IndyGoBlue.) I give most of the credit to my hub; he took what was a first class mess by Ogilvie and me, started fresh and IMO created a links-like rendition that is a masterpiece. I've chatted with people who've played AB for real but unfortunately never one who played ours also, just to get their opinion of it. (Probably wouldn't like it if they did! ) Polslad said in his review of the course that "the bar has been raised" and maybe I'm talking sheet here, but it seems like after this course (August 2007) the bar was indeed raised and the quality of courses has improved immensely since then. On the other hand, the number of active designers has diminished since then (WON pulled the rug out from under us around the same time, IIRC), 90% of new courses are turned out by maybe 6 people, and the new designers have been able to learn alot before they submit their first course.

My favorite designers (in no particular order):
Robert Wagers
Robert@
Baby Bull Conner
Dammpa
Ezmny2001
DanO (Bunch)
Glacken
Gunsaullus
Craig Johnson
Bobby Jones
KSBC6499
LeBranche
Lawinski
JJ (only 2 courses, but both wonderfully done)
Mr Whiffle
Polslad (undisputed prince of renditions, lol)
Somerfelt (undisputed king of renditions)
Grayson (Terry)
Trives
Spencer Turner
and Indy Anna Jones/IndyGoBlue

There are a few designers that made only a few courses and they're really good, but I didn't include any of those except JJ.

(*BTW, Hover & Jimi are one and the same. "Hover" is the earlier used name.)

spencerturner wrote:I think it would be very interesting for each designer active today to nominate a single course (1 only) of THEIR design for consideration to be added to Dar's "A" list or maybe a separate list entitled The Designers List. It dose'nt matter if it is already on the A list. This would be in the opinion of the designer only of what they consider to be THEIR very best work. Spencer.

I like the idea of a "Designers List." It would be hard for some like Robert@ who has about 65 to choose from.



My mention for the best designer is Robert Wagers. Every single one of his is an "A" course, as listed by Dar. You can't go wrong with the Wagemeister! Here are his courses:

Arrowhead Golf Club
Atchafalaya Basin
Coastal Links at Edisto Island (with Terry Grayson)
Greenbrier Resort
Magnolia Valley CC
The Country Club @ Terra Cotta Plantation
The Trenche at Monticello
The Valley Course @ Horseshoe Bend
Tomahawk Run
Travertine Island GC
Whipporwill Golf and CC